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Banned by Schlomobergerstein
#1
Your OOC name (byond username): Krautsalat

Your in-game name (Used most or at the time): Unit #13

Approximate Time of Ban (Give your best estimate. Used for investigation): See below

Ban Reason/Message (Copy paste or screenshot of the ban screen with round ID, banning admin visible):
[Image: ban.jpg]

State your appeal (Please limit to 500 words or less):


I think I did nothing wrong as a cyborg. As he stated, I was emagged and my syndie was dead. So I was basically free to do whatever. I acted like I would with asimov laws for most of the round, but when the cap tried to kill the CE I decided to intervene. I can't find any server rule that would prevent me from doing so. I guess he is assuming that silicons without laws have to behave like humans, but as far as I can tell, that is not the case. I've seen AIs flooding the station with plasma after a law purge and that never seemed to be a problem. So killing one guy to save another doesn't seem like a big deal to me. I believe the real issue here is that the guy I killed happened to be this admin. 

The thing with the hos on the other hand was kinda my fault, not gonna lie. I was a golem at that point and tried to help another golem. Things went south pretty quickly. But I doubt that alone would be worth a 7 day ban.
The warnings he mentions are pretty old btw. I played hundreds of hours on this server without any incidents.
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#2
To give an unbias opinion as a non admin,
I thought admins couldn’t handle their own ahelps?
:thinking:

I’ve never heard of the “purge” once your master is dead. Did they by chance give you any verbal orders that would justify you killing as an emagged borg? A lot of times, masters will tell their borgs to either lay low or have fun. I’m pretty sure you can’t do “whatever you want” because your master is dead as that would fall into the murderbone rule unless they gave you orders to do otherwise.
As for the HoS thing, not enough detail is given for me to have an opinion on it
[Image: signature.png]
The Infamous Fireball-Kills-You
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#3
(10-12-2019, 10:42 AM)Fofofo21 Wrote: To give an unbias opinion as a non admin,
I thought admins couldn’t handle their own ahelps?
:thinking:

I’ve never heard of the “purge” once your master is dead. Did they by chance give you any verbal orders that would justify you killing as an emagged borg? A lot of times, masters will tell their borgs to either lay low or have fun.  I’m pretty sure you can’t do “whatever you want” because your master is dead as that would fall into the murderbone rule unless they gave you orders to do otherwise.
As for the HoS thing, not enough detail is given for me to have an opinion on it

My master told me to have fun, nothing else.

There isn't much to say about the incident with the hos.
I was on the escape shuttle with a bunch of other golems when the hos attacked one of us. I gave him a whack with my baseball bat to discourage that behaviour, but he reponded with his energy gun in lethal mode. Me and another golem then proceeded to bash his head in. As I said, this is kinda my fault since I didn't try to talk to him first or anything.
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#4
(10-12-2019, 01:03 PM)Krautsalat Wrote:
(10-12-2019, 10:42 AM)Fofofo21 Wrote: To give an unbias opinion as a non admin,
I thought admins couldn’t handle their own ahelps?
:thinking:

I’ve never heard of the “purge” once your master is dead. Did they by chance give you any verbal orders that would justify you killing as an emagged borg? A lot of times, masters will tell their borgs to either lay low or have fun.  I’m pretty sure you can’t do “whatever you want” because your master is dead as that would fall into the murderbone rule unless they gave you orders to do otherwise.
As for the HoS thing, not enough detail is given for me to have an opinion on it

My master told me to have fun, nothing else.

There isn't much to say about the incident with the hos.
I was on the escape shuttle with a bunch of other golems when the hos attacked one of us. I gave him a whack with my baseball bat to discourage that behaviour, but he reponded with his energy gun in lethal mode. Me and another golem then proceeded to bash his head in. As I said, this is kinda my fault since I didn't try to talk to him first or anything.
A staff member will probably log dive to see any orders your master gave to you as a borg. If there is substantial evidence that your master told you to have fun... what you did as a borg could be understandable. Although, even though flooding plasma, mass killing, or complete grief could be argued as “fun,” it’s a dick move and will probably get you in big trouble (This is just for future reference). 

As for the HoS issue, what you did was completely wrong. You are not justified in baiting an attack and killing in self defense, but you admitted it was wrong and I think 7 days is a little harsh and may be bias since you killed the banning admin
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#5
(10-12-2019, 08:07 PM)Fofofo21 Wrote:
(10-12-2019, 01:03 PM)Krautsalat Wrote:
(10-12-2019, 10:42 AM)Fofofo21 Wrote: To give an unbias opinion as a non admin,
I thought admins couldn’t handle their own ahelps?
:thinking:

I’ve never heard of the “purge” once your master is dead. Did they by chance give you any verbal orders that would justify you killing as an emagged borg? A lot of times, masters will tell their borgs to either lay low or have fun.  I’m pretty sure you can’t do “whatever you want” because your master is dead as that would fall into the murderbone rule unless they gave you orders to do otherwise.
As for the HoS thing, not enough detail is given for me to have an opinion on it

My master told me to have fun, nothing else.

There isn't much to say about the incident with the hos.
I was on the escape shuttle with a bunch of other golems when the hos attacked one of us. I gave him a whack with my baseball bat to discourage that behaviour, but he reponded with his energy gun in lethal mode. Me and another golem then proceeded to bash his head in. As I said, this is kinda my fault since I didn't try to talk to him first or anything.
A staff member will probably log dive to see any orders your master gave to you as a borg. If there is substantial evidence that your master told you to have fun... what you did as a borg could be understandable. Although, even though flooding plasma, mass killing, or complete grief could be argued as “fun,” it’s a dick move and will probably get you in big trouble (This is just for future reference). 

As for the HoS issue, what you did was completely wrong. You are not justified in baiting an attack and killing in self defense, but you admitted it was wrong and I think 7 days is a little harsh and may be bias since you killed the banning admin
Fofofo21 hit the nail right on the head
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#6
Its ya boy shlomo. If you remember correctly i didn't boink you for actually killing me, however i did make a note of it for future reference hoping you wouldn't continue with poor behavior. In general yes admins should NOT handle their own issues however due to the lack of currently online admins i had to take up the responsibility of doing it. As the banning admin however its important to know that i will likely be biased towards no appeal, therefore i advise you wait until another staff member chimes in on the matter
Omnes una manet Nox. Dum spiro, spero. Per angusta ad augusta. Per aspera ad paradisum.
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#7
(Yesterday, 04:01 PM)Shlomobergerstein Wrote: Its ya boy shlomo. If you remember correctly i didn't boink you for actually killing me, however i did make a note of it for future reference hoping you wouldn't continue with poor behavior. In general yes admins should NOT handle their own issues however due to the lack of currently online admins i had to take up the responsibility of doing it. As the banning admin however its important to know that i will likely be biased towards no appeal, therefore i advise you wait until another staff member chimes in on the matter

That's basically why I wrote the appeal in the first place. I now have a (probably very vague) note attached to my account, saying I sharded the captain as a borg which can get me a job ban if I make an actual mistake in the future. I don't think thats fair, given the circumstances. Nothing I did as a borg that round counts as "poor behaviour" in my opinion.
I read the rules very carefully after this event and I can't find anything about "emagged borgs being effectively purged when the syndie dies" or even that borgs have to behave like any other non-antag crewmember when they do get purged. Keep in mind that silicons have to adhere to a higher roleplay standard than other crewmembers and that it is plausible for a purged borg or AI to go rogue (there is a reason why they have laws in the first place). I personally don't play that way, but I do think it would be valid. I could be wrong about this of course. I believe it would be wise to mention silicons in rule 2 & rule 1.3 if they would apply in this case, since silicons are usually handled a little differently on other servers.

I just wanted to get this off my chest. I don't think lifting the ban is necessary at this point since its almost over anyway. But I would appreciate it if the note was removed.
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